What is your dream headlight for the Sterling?

[rickjames8]

I'm curious if other folks are like me, in that as you drive around you're constantly looking at other cars for interesting donor parts. I always like to imagine what certain headlights would look like on the Sterling. Unfortunately, so many modern headlights have crazy compound curves that wrap around the fender, so it'd be impossible to adapt to the sterling. Viewing the light from head-on, it looks perfect, but as you look closer, you realize it could never be made to work. The only time I've seen a curved light attempted was with Mercury Cougar lights, and I didn't like the result. Just not my style:

So one option I've been thinking about lately is the Fiat Coupe (also known as the V20).

A couple nice things about this light. First off, they really fit with the lines of the car. They're plentiful in europe (going rate is about €200/pair) and they've been fitted in before and I think they work well.

The other day I noticed an Alfa Brera, and noticed that it has 3 standalone front facing projectors. They're set diagonally, but in a way that could really work.

After taking some basic measurements, I think they could me made to work in the Sterling. I'd sink them in a little like this (KTM Crossbow):

So here in France, regulations are very strict, so I'm confined to using something off a production car. I can't order projectors off eBay and install them. If I could make my own custom lights, I like these:

I'm curious what others think. What have you seen that looked good? What do you have? What have you tried? What have you dreamt about trying to adapt to a Sterling?

 

[nbb350]

"aim lower"... your sample pix are mostly exotics; I can't imagine that headlights from a Lambo or such are cheap, even in EU.
The Fiat V20 seems like a good idea. Fiats aren't expensive over here at least!

 

[rickjames8]

"aim lower"... your sample pix are mostly exotics; I can't imagine that headlights from a Lambo or such are cheap, even in EU.
The Fiat V20 seems like a good idea. Fiats aren't expensive over here at least!

100% correct. I had no intention of sourcing used Lambo headlights. I just like to see how some designers add headlights in cars. I like to take the visual cues, and see how something similar could be replicated using other (non-exotic) parts. So for instance, taking the Brera lights, but mounting them similar to the Lamborghini.

 

[farfegnubbin]

I'm curious if other folks are like me, in that as you drive around you're constantly looking at other cars for interesting donor parts.

I absolutely, positively do this and have done so for years. What my brain sees is largely based on what I'm trying to design at the moment, so there was the "Tail Light Era" where I noticed all tail lights, the "Grill Era," the "Windshield Wiper Era," the "Dash Era," etc., etc. ...and yes, definitely the "Headlight Era," continuing into the present, where I notice almost every headlight that goes by.

But yeah, over the years I have found very, very few stock headlight assemblies that fit the Sterling in terms of style or physical space available. They are either are a wrong shape -- integral with fender lines that are way different than the Sterling (like you said) -- or they are about the right lines but they just don't friggin fit.

I know I'm saying stuff you already know, but the headlight wells of the Sterling, although they are very DEEP, are actually very narrow and short. I've never found a totally stock modern light assembly that fits well.

I agree that that Fiat assembly comes pretty close. Years ago I bought a pair from Ebay in the UK and had them shipped over to me in the States. They were narrow enough. And they kinda sorta followed the body lines. Then I saw a photo of someone one who had put them in a blue Nova and I didn't like how they were integrated. But years later I found the same photos of that deep red Nova in Poland with the de-seamed hood and Fiat headlights and I think they look really good. I wouldn't veto using those. Oh, here is a photo of a third Nova that used those Fiat lights. It's a pretty good perspective showing how they jibe with body lines. It's not perfect, but it's good.

I've tried several VW assemblies (GTI, Jetta, etc.) I've tried an assembly off one of the Jeep products. I always liked the dual, little round headlights from an Acura Integra. ALL of these assemblies were way to wide and tall.

It really sucks that France won't let you mix and match something custom. Some of my favorite Nova/Sterling/Eureka headlights over the years have been custom arrays where the builder used, say, a collection of staggered round headlights and directionals in a way that simulates a modern assembly. I found a few examples. (There are many others.) Rick M had an excellent custom array (red car.)

But I know those don't necessarily help you if they don't allow non-OEM headlights. That said, most of these were made from a combination of actual legit headlights from cars from back when headlights were simple shapes. I wonder how they would view that. If you can make something that LOOKS like a modern composite headlight but that is using the equivalent of DOT certified simple headlights, I wonder if that could get passed.

Anyhow, as a final thought for the moment, 25 years ago when I was mainly focused on my blue Sterling I did find one factory assembly that came very close to working: Headlights from a '92 era Honda Civic. They are among the most compact assemblies I ever found, they are still plentiful, and they have a host of aftermarket variations (like projectors, LEDs, angel eyes, etc.) They don't quite fit. I was planning on making a notch on the side of the hood (NOT the top surface of the hood) to kind of hide the front corner of the assembly. Oh, also, note that there are two different styles of these lights. One has the headlights as a module separate from the turn signals. That's the one that fits. Anyway, here are some very old, low res photos of my mock-up.

Anyhow, yeah, I had talked myself into using those Civic lights because they were a better option than others but I still didn't love them.

In the prototype of the new Sterling model that I've been chipping away at I am using a custom array made up of motorcycle headlights. I like how they're are turning out. But that project isn't ready to share yet.

Other generic thoughts are:
1) Don't break the fender line. As soon as anyone has broken through the outboard "wall" of the headlight bay, the car instantly doesn't look like a Nova.
2) Be careful if considering encroach into the hood. Once that body line of the hood is broken, things look weird fast.

I'm glad to hear that you're still poking at your car. I know life gets busy.

 

[sector]

Based on my research, the most compact version that I found are the headlights from the 1993-97 Chevrolet Camero.

 

[letterman7]

Somewhere else on this page I had mentioned Acura lights fit almost perfectly if you cut away the plexiglass. Here's the thread: https://sterlingkitcars.com/index.php?threads/headlights.1308/#post-17662

 

[rickjames8]

I absolutely, positively do this and have done so for years. What my brain sees is largely based on what I'm trying to design at the moment, so there was the "Tail Light Era" where I noticed all tail lights, the "Grill Era," the "Windshield Wiper Era," the "Dash Era," etc., etc. ...and yes, definitely the "Headlight Era," continuing into the present, where I notice almost every headlight that goes by.

Hey Warren - Always great to get your insights. Yep, I'm guessing most car builders do this- especially on long road trips.

But yeah, over the years I have found very, very few stock headlight assemblies that fit the Sterling in terms of style or physical space available. They are either are a wrong shape -- integral with fender lines that are way different than the Sterling (like you said) -- or they are about the right lines but they just don't friggin fit.

I know I'm saying stuff you already know, but the headlight wells of the Sterling, although they are very DEEP, are actually very narrow and short. I've never found a totally stock modern light assembly that fits well.

Yep - I think the Sterling itself is deceivingly small. I'm always a little surprised when I see it parked next to a standard sized family car. I think proportionally that makes it 'feel' like the headlight bucket is bigger too.

It really sucks that France won't let you mix and match something custom. Some of my favorite Nova/Sterling/Eureka headlights over the years have been custom arrays where the builder used, say, a collection of staggered round headlights and directionals in a way that simulates a modern assembly. I found a few examples. (There are many others.) Rick M had an excellent custom array (red car.)

They might. I've not yet tried to get through the inspection process. I think it also depends on the inspection station you go to. I'm trying to see if anyone knows a 'friendly' station. I've also found that if you include some paperwork, it tends to help the person justify approving it. Like I did with my letters for the FFVE. I figure if I can buy something and come up with a piece of documentation that makes it look like it's legal, it might help. Using older standard bulbs should work in that regard.

Anyhow, as a final thought for the moment, 25 years ago when I was mainly focused on my blue Sterling I did find one factory assembly that came very close to working: Headlights from a '92 era Honda Civic. They are among the most compact assemblies I ever found, they are still plentiful, and they have a host of aftermarket variations (like projectors, LEDs, angel eyes, etc.)

This is something I play with in my head. If I find an OEM one that fits, I can pass the test and then swap out for an aftermarket one, and keep the OEMs for the next test. Tests here are every 5 years for older cars.

In the prototype of the new Sterling model that I've been chipping away at I am using a custom array made up of motorcycle headlights. I like how they're are turning out. But that project isn't ready to share yet.

Any chance for a sneak preview in person? I'll be in the US in October. ;-)

Other generic thoughts are:
1) Don't break the fender line. As soon as anyone has broken through the outboard "wall" of the headlight bay, the car instantly doesn't look like a Nova.

Yep, other than the Cougar lights above, I haven't see any examples, but something tells me it wouldn't work. Do you have other pics? The only light I considered that would require a cut on the side was from a Puma. They have a 'ridge' that runs along the outside that I think would line up with the ridge in the Sterling fender. However, I think the angle drops off too quickly.

2) Be careful if considering encroach into the hood. Once that body line of the hood is broken, things look weird fast.

Interesting you mention this. I just ordered a set of those Alfa Romeo Brera/159 lights (I mean, ordering new lights for a car that doesn't run is the perfect order to do things in, right??). They were 30 bucks for the pair, so I thought I'd try them out. They're much bigger than I expected. I'm not fully committed to using them, but I had a couple ideas:
1. cut out the hood a little bit
2. cut off one of the 3 light pods. Technically I'd still be running OEM lights, just not the whole thing.

Do you have any photos of people who've tried to cut the hood?

I'm glad to hear that you're still poking at your car. I know life gets busy.

Yep, actually working on it more than planned. I'll update my build thread today.

 

[farfegnubbin]

1) Yes, let me find some other photos of a few headlight successes and fails. It’s interesting what works and what doesn’t.

2) Yes, if you’re in the states and in the area I would love to give you a peek at the prototype. I know we’ve crossed paths in Carlisle. I live very close to Hershey, PA. I think you’ll like the new car.