letterman7
Honorary Admin
They do: Universal Slider Kit Perspex Window Kit Race Rally | eBay
I'm sure there is stuff stateside, I just didn't search that closely.
I'm sure there is stuff stateside, I just didn't search that closely.
Window vents
- Thread starter Brett Proctor
- Start date
Brett Proctor
Well-known member
figured this belongs here more than in my build section.
OK WHAT IF
The stock window had rails on it for a section of the glass to slide on. I don't have the machanics figured out yet just brain storming. This would also let you retain the stock hinges so it would still open like the manufacturer designed it to.
Check out the pictures for a better understanding of where I'm going with this.
OK WHAT IF
The stock window had rails on it for a section of the glass to slide on. I don't have the machanics figured out yet just brain storming. This would also let you retain the stock hinges so it would still open like the manufacturer designed it to.
Check out the pictures for a better understanding of where I'm going with this.
Attachments
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letterman7
Honorary Admin
Interesting sideways thinking. Don't see a drawback other than you would need to make sure the bottom edge was well supported. I reckon in theory a channel could be placed into the canopy cavity where the OE window would be. You would need a bypass channel like on an RV or bus window so the panel could slide past the other.
Flyer615
New member
I think your biggest obstacle for this setup is going to be how to keep the side glass from rotating out of the channel that it slides in. From the picture, it looks like the glass could be easily rotated in a clockwise fashion out of the bottom channel. You are probably going to find that when you get the top cut over far enough to keep that from happening, you will only have an inch or so of slide. Hard to tell for sure from pics, though.
As I'm thinking about it, here's a test to see if it'll stay in track. Tie a pencil with a string as if you're going to draw a large radius. Start at either end of the cut and let out enough string to reach the other side (bottom or top) of the window. Then, add about a half inch to the string length (ie. the radius). This will have it intersect the edge of the glass in two places. If it doesn't, the glass will rotate out of the channel. Of course, all this is assuming that the glass was going to run in a channel with no other means of holding it in.
As I'm thinking about it, here's a test to see if it'll stay in track. Tie a pencil with a string as if you're going to draw a large radius. Start at either end of the cut and let out enough string to reach the other side (bottom or top) of the window. Then, add about a half inch to the string length (ie. the radius). This will have it intersect the edge of the glass in two places. If it doesn't, the glass will rotate out of the channel. Of course, all this is assuming that the glass was going to run in a channel with no other means of holding it in.
Brett Proctor
Well-known member
OK I'm still playing with ideas on this.
Another WHAT IF
Make the window in two sections and they work indepentent of each other. Use a frameless shower door seal to make a seal between the two windows. Doing this also gets rid of the gap between the window and the frame.
Using the same hardware as the stock set up
Except that you could have a release so the rear section opens up fully so you guys with toll boths can have room to toss your money out. You would not drive with the window fully open like this.
Front section still opens like stock
Both windows could be opened at the same time
Just some brain storming
Brett
Another WHAT IF
Make the window in two sections and they work indepentent of each other. Use a frameless shower door seal to make a seal between the two windows. Doing this also gets rid of the gap between the window and the frame.
Using the same hardware as the stock set up
Except that you could have a release so the rear section opens up fully so you guys with toll boths can have room to toss your money out. You would not drive with the window fully open like this.
Front section still opens like stock
Both windows could be opened at the same time
Just some brain storming
Brett
Brett Proctor
Well-known member
No comments??
Don't know if thats a good thing or a bad thing. Oh well it was just thought.
Don't know if thats a good thing or a bad thing. Oh well it was just thought.
letterman7
Honorary Admin
Still digesting how it would work in the real world. Really, I wouldn't worry about guys that deal with toll booths. If you don't, then why build for it? I'm still kind of preferring the slider over this idea, though..
Flyer615
New member
I think my favorite idea is something like the Cimbria boys have. I believe I would like it best if the front hinge of the window is a slide-in pin in the hinge. A quick disconnect on the latch would release, allowing the window to go out. Then, just slide the window (and half of the hinges) out of the half that is attached to the car. That way, the entire thing is out of the way, but could be carried in a pouch behind the seat. Works a little like the doors on the old Jeep CJ's.
I didn't comment on the latest idea because I was the one "shooting down" the last one. I didn't want you to think I only ever see the negative. I will say, however, that you might have some difficulty if you hinge the two pieces on different planes (ie, one on the "A" pillar and one on the top). You can tape along the top edges of the two pieces, then tip out at the bottom. the seam will get farther apart at the bottom. Although, to be honest, I'm not sure I completely understood what you had in mind for holding the back one down when closed. I assume the tip-out latch is attached to the front glass.
Really, Brett, I'm not someone always trying to find fault.
I didn't comment on the latest idea because I was the one "shooting down" the last one. I didn't want you to think I only ever see the negative. I will say, however, that you might have some difficulty if you hinge the two pieces on different planes (ie, one on the "A" pillar and one on the top). You can tape along the top edges of the two pieces, then tip out at the bottom. the seam will get farther apart at the bottom. Although, to be honest, I'm not sure I completely understood what you had in mind for holding the back one down when closed. I assume the tip-out latch is attached to the front glass.
Really, Brett, I'm not someone always trying to find fault.
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Brett Proctor
Well-known member
I expect negative feed back.
These are just ideas. I didn't say they were good ones
These are just ideas. I didn't say they were good ones
Peter
Active member
Another stupid idea. *nothing to see*
What about parallel mounts? If one had the window mounted on three (or four) arms top and bottom, say two bottom and one top, then one could swing the whole window out and back (or forward) leaving double the arm length open at the rear. the front or rear open depending on the length of the arms. I don't think it work vertically but horizontally one could go forward or rear with the idea, if, as in my case, the mirrors would be in the way then rearwards would leave the front 3/4 open and the mirror adjustable too..
p.s. if the arms were a little longer at the rear it would work better in this example as the rear would stick out a bit more to clear the body and the angle for entry into the front would be better, or not?
more thiking =
What about parallel mounts? If one had the window mounted on three (or four) arms top and bottom, say two bottom and one top, then one could swing the whole window out and back (or forward) leaving double the arm length open at the rear. the front or rear open depending on the length of the arms. I don't think it work vertically but horizontally one could go forward or rear with the idea, if, as in my case, the mirrors would be in the way then rearwards would leave the front 3/4 open and the mirror adjustable too..
p.s. if the arms were a little longer at the rear it would work better in this example as the rear would stick out a bit more to clear the body and the angle for entry into the front would be better, or not?
more thiking =
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I like a few of these ideas but when it comes down to it you will get the most airflow by either venting the windows (stock) and a fresh air source through dash vents or with the windows completely out. Anything in between will really be a convenience thing to reach your hand out of the window.
Not to go off topic but one thing I have thought about off and on is not messing with the side windows but rather the rear tunnel. Make that glass removable or able to fold down to give more air movement. Sadly that's as far as I got with the ideal.
Not to go off topic but one thing I have thought about off and on is not messing with the side windows but rather the rear tunnel. Make that glass removable or able to fold down to give more air movement. Sadly that's as far as I got with the ideal.
letterman7
Honorary Admin
Sadly, that's the one thing you don't want to do. The engine noise is hugely magnified with the window out. Early Nova models that didn't have opening windows had vents built into the rear edge of the canopy so that air would come in through the dash vent and go out the roof. I thought it a great idea and wondered why it never was kept. It would make humid and rainy days a little more bearable letting the air flow through easier.
Dangit, I never thought about that. Makes too much sense.
Talking about airflow, if you're wanting to ventilate the cabin, you really do need airflow. It comes down to fluid dynamics. If you're wanting to let air into the car to cool you down, you also need to let the air back out. If you don't have sufficient airflow, the overall effect will be lowered or maybe even canceled out.
Imagine that your car is a bottle. You then put it under the tap to fill it with cold water. After a bit, the bottle is full and the excess water just flows out of the bottle. This happens with air too. Believe it or not, if you were to drive any car with all the other windows closed, the air would rush out your open window, where it's just come in! Ever noticed your hair (or dust, etc) seemingly swirl around near the open window? This is because your car has turned into a 'whirlpool' of air, with the one entry/exit point.
But this isn't exactly true.
I'm not sure what modern cars use, but older cars had a ventilation system, where the air comes in through your dash vents (for this example, lets assume all windows are closed), and then leave out the back of the car. It passes through some vents either on the rear pillars, or around the rear seats, maybe the parcel shelf, then out through one or two exterior vents, usually behind the rear bumper. This vent is usually something pretty basic, obviously some form of open vent, but on the outer side of the vent (directly behind the bumper), is a strip of rubber/plastic. When you have the windows closed and the dash vents open only part way, there isn't much air pressure, and the rubber/plastic strip or flap hardly moves. But have the dash vents blasting, and/or all windows open, the air pressure is much higher, and this pushes the rubber/plastic strip open more, letting more air out of the car.
I had a thought of using one or two of these in the cockpit of the car. But where to 'vent' the air too? You could perhaps vent it to the engine bay or rear wheel wells, but then you'll probably get more engine/road noise. Maybe have them hooked up to a flexible tube and run to the back of the car? That may work, not totally sure.
That took longer to explain that I thought it would. lol I just hope it makes sense. One last note, these exterior vents don't look the greatest. They're not meant to be seen. I though you could make an frame or surround for them, and cover them with something like the perforated metal from an old speaker housing.
This vent is from an Audi TT/VW Passat.
And a diagram of where to find such vents on a Skoda Yeti.
The forum I found the above diagram (Skoda forum), called them 'rear air extraction flaps'. That might help people when searching for them online.
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hotrodbones
New member
Brett,
I personally like the sliding horizontal option. I would only be concerned about how to seal them from rain. Im thinking old VW bus here. but the back part of the window was on the inside of the two pieces. that way rain while driving wouldnt be forced in the gap when closed and driving. While parked, the rails had a drain hole, so any sitting water would go to the lowest point (the drain hole) and then be drained out. sometimes it was just a slit in the trim, and sometimes they ran a little fuel line or even rubber vacumn house thru the body and out the bottom of the car. this option could lead to problems later if you dont have the best seal.
I personally like the sliding horizontal option. I would only be concerned about how to seal them from rain. Im thinking old VW bus here. but the back part of the window was on the inside of the two pieces. that way rain while driving wouldnt be forced in the gap when closed and driving. While parked, the rails had a drain hole, so any sitting water would go to the lowest point (the drain hole) and then be drained out. sometimes it was just a slit in the trim, and sometimes they ran a little fuel line or even rubber vacumn house thru the body and out the bottom of the car. this option could lead to problems later if you dont have the best seal.
Peter
Active member
Tried my design *insane*with some 5mm alloy square tubing, some Lego hinges and a bit of 2mm plastic and with the rear arms 1/2" longer than the fronts and the top one 1/4" longer it works a treat, soon as I get it spot on I'll post a photo or three. but I can say, arm right out, mirror accessible and it sits back tight.*thumbs up*
Exit vent wise I have seen a few with vents in the side above the engine lid in the triangle bit.
Exit vent wise I have seen a few with vents in the side above the engine lid in the triangle bit.
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Brett Proctor
Well-known member
very seldom do I go with my first ideas. Usually my first few ideas are pretty bad but its something to work from. I like to refine things as much as possible before I get into the building stage so I don't end up changing things down the road and it ends up costing more money.
Case in point
I may have a way to put power windows in the car. I have the window tracks figured out and I have the basic layout of things figured out. Now if I can come up with the machanics that will fit in the space where I want to put it, I should be able to put power windows in the car. If I cann't find the machanical parts the windows will be able to work manualy.
I will see if I can come up with the materials to do this. If the project gets a green light I'll let you know
Brett
Brett Proctor
Well-known member
The forum I found the above diagram (Skoda forum), called them 'rear air extraction flaps'. That might help people when searching for them online.
Every car now adays has these but You might be missing the real reason why.
Air Bags
When these things go off they are like bombs and the pressure that they generate is enough to blow your ear drums out. I've been told that they can cause brain damage also. So the engineers had to find a way to releave the inside pressure when they go off and this is what they came up with.
Thats the story I was told for the need for those vents
Brett
letterman7
Honorary Admin
That's an interesting story. Never heard that explanation before. Vents like those were in all (at least American built) cars back into even the early '70's, tucked into the door pillars and behind cab seats in pickup trucks.